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03/07/198511 CITY OF GRAND TERRACE COUNCIL MINUTES ADJOURNED JOINT REGULAR MEETING - MARCH 7, 1985 An adjourned joint regular meeting of the City Council with the Planning Commission of the City of Grand Terrace was called to order in the Council Chambers, Grand Terrace Civic Center, 22795 Barton Road, Grand Terrace, California, on March 7, 1985, at 7:05 p.m. PRESENT: Hugh J. Grant, Mayor Sanford L. Collins, Chairman Byron Matteson, Mayor Pro Tempore Ray Munson, Vice -Chairman Tony Petta, Councilman John McDowell, Commissioner Barbara Pfennighausen, Councilwoman William DeBenedet, Commissioner Dennis L. Evans, Councilman Jerry Hawkinson, Commissioner Norman Caouette, Commissioner Seth Armstead, City Manager Vern Andress, Commissioner Ivan Hopkins, City Attorney Gerald Cole, Commissioner Joe Kicak, Planning Director Tim D. Serlet, Planning Staff Myrna Erway, City Clerk ABSENT: Winifred Bartel, Commissioner The meeting was opened with the Pledge of Allegiance, led by Mayor Pro Tem Matteson. P age 1 - 3/7/85 Mayor Grant advised the joint meeting was requested by Councilwoman Pfennighausen and Councilman Evans, with Council concurring, to discuss various issues and policies. Councilwoman Pfennighausen and Councilman Evans advised Council recently attended an economic development seminar which recommended coordinated effort by Council Members and Planning Commissioners to establish beneficial development goals for the City. QUESTIONS POSED TO COMMISSION AND STAFF BY COUNCIL Councilman Evans questioned the Commissioners: (1) What are your conceptions of both residential and commercial development in Grand Terrace? (2) Where do you envision the development occurring? (3) Why are you a Commissioner in the community? (4) What have you done toward furthering your developmental goals? Questioned Planning Director Kicak and Planner Serlet regarding problems encountered with Commissioners and requested they address the size of the Planning Commission. Mayor Pro Tem Matteson questioned what problems are incurred by the Planning Commissioners in performing duties and how Council could assist. RESPONSES Chairman Collins stated he would prefer no additional development in the City as evidenced by his voting record; recommended establishing restrictive regulations in the Blue Mountain area by ordinance as soon as possible; concerned proposals could soon be presented to develop the hillside.and there currently are no standards for development of that area. The City paid a consultant, Gale Carr, who advised the Planning Commission on commercially developing an area; he stressed never to strip -zone, yet Barton Road has been strip -zoned for commercial development. Relative to the controversial General Plan, feels the City has the right to either change the General Plan or leave it as it presently exists; criticized the manner in which changes and revisions were referred back to the Commission during the twenty or more meetings conducted on the General Plan Update; objected to the Housing Element not being approved by the Commission. Feels the City should take action to guarantee access across Gage Canal; won't support high -density development of that area until this occurs. Was a candidate for the first City Council; subsequently accepted a request to serve on the Planning Committee. Stated one of the City's major assets is an excellent school system; noted two of the three schools are located in residential areas, but Grand Terrace Elementary is unsuitably located in a commercial, high -traffic area; recommended relocating Grand Terrace Elementary to a residential area in the southern area of the City to further enhance the school system and then commercially develop that site. Requested the Planning Commission be notified of Council action on Planning Commission decisions appealed to Council. Commissioner McDowell felt it unfortunate the City failed in its attempt to become a harter City due to misleading statements circulated that Council could raise taxes - noted Proposition 13 prohibited that, as he previously pointed out. The City will not acquire needed revenue as a residential City; supports commercially developing area adjacent to the freeway. Advised the Planning Committee and Commission initiated ordinances for litter control, property maintenance, and parking. Felt residential development will have to be multiple dwellings in the northwest area of the City where some excellent developers are proposing construction; will not support ghetto development. He applied to serve on the Planning Committee and was eventually appointed. Noted as Chairman of the previous Economic Development Ad Hoc Committee, he worked toward a proposed shopping mall in the freeway area. Vice -Chairman Munson advised he became a Planning Commissioner because e wanted to become involved in the City. His education in planning came from other members and study at home - would like to become more knowledgeable. Stated he was involved in most of the General Plan Update; doesn't totally agree with it; would have liked more foresight in the disputed R-3 area. Concurs with Chairman Collins relative to Page 2 - 3/7/85 FIJ Gage Canal access with more than one entrance; would like a green belt area east of Canal Street. Decisions are what the Commission feels are right even though they know Council will overturn them. Requested Council direction as to what it wants. Commissioner DeBenedet stated he would have appreciated knowing the purpose of the meeting to allow preparation; concurred with many of Commissioner McDowell's statements; favors monitoring quality building and beautification of the City - experience as a developer and architect enables him to visualize architecture in advance and offers opinions accordingly. Relative to R-3 zoning on Mt. Vernon north of Barton Road, recommended the City take action to gain access across Gage Canal so prospective developers can be advised of access requirements in that area. Recommended additional joint meetings. Commissioner Andress stated he became a Commissioner to contribute to the Community. Is concerned about beautification - opposes the ghetto look; felt there was poor planning on the County's part on the two main thoroughfares and doesn't want that to reoccur. Prefers a semi -rural, bedroom community. Favored commercial development to increase revenue within reason if it wouldn't change overall appearance and living quality - felt growth has to be in the obvious open areas. Felt the City needs proper blending of moderate and high -cost housing. Has been outspoken regarding traffic flow, use of school facilities, quality of affordable education, and not overcrowding. Commissioner Andress, with Commissioners DeBenedet and Munson concurring, felt the Commission is often looked upon as a committee, that it serves as the Council's whipping boys to ferret out little problems and take the heat off Council; felt there is a need for more cooperation and communication between the two bodies; felt the Commission and the Council should never endorse each other's actions entirely; requested Council direction on what it wants. Commissioner Caouette advised he is a planner by profession and became a Planning ommissioner to contribute his experience. Relative to concept of development in Grand Terrace, sees more high -quality residential environment; commercial development of the City is at a disadvantage because of limited population which doesn't allow for larger scale commercial development and tends to focus on local service needs; concurs some strip -zoning has occurred on Barton Road, which historically is a mistake creating clutter of signs, parking problems, ingress and egress to main thoroughfares. Supports commercial development adjacent to the freeway to take advantage of people outside the City generating tax dollars otherwise escaping the community; would require the City to develop infrastructure creating good access to develop that area. Feels the City currently has too much commercially -zoned property; this runs the risk of creating an oversupply, making it too cheap to purchase commercial property which results in a level of commercial development less than what the standards should be for Grand Terrace. Stated his experience as a Planning Commissioner dealing with the development process in Grand Terrace has been frustrating; feels sometimes decisions have been made Page 3 - 3/7/85 on some matters prior to being processed through the Commission. Wants predictability and follow-through of the planning process by adherence to the standards as established in the zoning code. Developers should read the zoning code and take time to understand the objectives and goals of the planning process and the General Plan process, then should have some reasonable expectation of project approval if it meets those standards. Recommended providing samples to the developers indicating parking, landscaping and setback requirements. Feels there have been occasions when developers have hustled the City, claiming failure if not allowed to do certain things. Concerned that developers contact and involve Council when misunderstandings occur between the developers and Planning Staff and request deviation from the standards established by Council in the zoning ordinance; understands the need for flexibility, but if Council doesn't support Staff in the enforcement of the zoning ordinance, it doesn't do much for the credibility and follow-through of the planning process, and results in the Commission questioning why some projects are presented with incomplete staffing and why they don't come close to meeting the zoning ordinance requirements. Commissioner Cole stated he is a long-time resident; became a Planning Commissioner to become involved. Concerned about the growth and manner of future development of the City. Favors planned commercial development along the freeway. Is not opposed to high density development if properly done. Traffic circulation on Mt. Vernon and Barton Road are his concerns. Felt the Commission needs to give staff stronger, more definite direction. Commissioner Hawkinson stated the City has always impressed him; has pride and sense of nging; has served on ad hoc committees. His conceptions are same as those expressed. Felt the City must make the best balanced use of residential and commercial land available. Felt the restrictions posed by the sign ordinances were too harsh and deterred business. Noted he has years of financial management experience; therefore, realizes need for increased revenue to enable the City to provide residents with services and storm drains; also felt there are potential problems with the water system. Felt traffic is a big problem, citing the north entrance. Commissioner Hawkinson, with Commissioner DeBenedet concurring, recommended some of the developer's problems be resolved prior to presentation to the Commission in order to shorten meeting time spent on single items; recommended preparing a list of standards outlining exact requirements for developers. Planning Director Kicak, relative to incomplete packages presented to the Commission, stated there are standards that staff tries to enforce, regardless of who the applicant is, and those are generally met prior to the matter going before the Commission; however, there have been exceptions. As far as working with a large body, found no problem working with five to nine Commissioners; felt a large group is more difficult, but not suggesting size be reduced, since the philosophy of Council was to get more citizens involved. Page 4 - 3/7/85 Tim Serlet, Planning Staff, felt that meeting only once a month breaks the continuity between staff and the Commission. Felt the Planning Commissioners should immediately advise staff if they feel the package is incomplete - tries to expedite getting developers' projects before the Commission, rather than making them wait another month; objects to a developer accusing staff of delaying a project when in reality staff is not; felt support of staff is needed. Recess was called at 8:20 p.m and reconvened at 8:37 p.m. with all members present. Commissioner Caouette clarified that his previous statements should not a construed as a criticism of staff; has spent many years as a staff member dealing with the same situations confronting staff so is aware of the many pitfalls, and that the development process is difficult. Feels the small size of Grand Terrace and having many accessible bosses places staff in a difficult position; feels they do a very good job and should be commended. QUESTIONS POSED BY THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO COUNCIL: Commissioner McDowell questioned Council as follows: (1) What is your opinion of the various ordinances and your philosphy on enforcement of property value maintenance? (2) What is your understanding and philosophy on commercial development? RESPONSES: Mayor Grant stated his position is well publicized; felt commercial development is of vital importance to the community; the City needs a better tax base; felt the need for a well -planned access. Helping existing businesses could increase sales tax. Ordinances are only as good as their policy, the ability to enforce, and to the extent they do not infringe on personal freedom and do not violate constitutional rights. Regarding the sign ordinance, felt Council had been overzealous in the past, which is being remedied. Felt it important for a municipality to enforce good standards; felt there is need for some improvement relative to property maintenance. Councilman Evans referenced the recent Planning Commission meeting which included a review of an applicant's apartment complex; noted the Commission made reference to the developer going across Gage Canal but never took positive action to clearly state that access across the canal is necessary and advising staff that either the City or the developer should take action to acquire that access; feels if this is a requirement for approval of the project, it should be clearly stated. Relative to the concern for increased traffic in the area being considered for multifamily development, stated his question would be what kind of action is the community taking in addressing the problem, or should the community expect a potential developer to bring in a Page 5 - 3/7/85 circulation element; felt the Commission should address this issue and express its views. Councilwoman Pfenni hausen voiced support for enforcement of the spirit o an ordinance; felt enforcement to the letter is dictatorial. If an ordinance if difficult to enforce without variances, it should be reviewed; suggested review of the zoning ordinance. Felt any development should be serviceable and in scale to the community. Never felt the proposed regional shopping mall was a reality; Barton Road is at least the beginning and has immediate access. Felt Council's attitude has discouraged development. Is aware the Planning Commission labors over what is given them; feels the planning process should be streamlined; had requested that a copy of Cathedral City's flow chart be provided to see if the City could implement a similar program. Mayor Pro Tem Matteson favored having this type of meeting; felt cooperation between --staff and all working bodies is important; recommended the Planning Commission develop procedures with staff. Councilman Petta questioned the status of acquiring Gage Canal access, ee ing that needed to be resolved prior to establishing density in that area. Mr. Kicak advised Gage Canal has denied all requests; therefore, has contacted the City of Riverside, hoping for a more positive response. Felt locations of crossings should be determined before any further action; noted Council had previously indicated it would proceed with condemnation if the matter results in a standstill. Councilman Petta noted part of the area discussed as a possible new school site is under consideration for a subdivision or a parcel map; Requested, and received concurrence from Council and the Commissioners to direct staff to research that area, with no commitments; if the site is adequate, take steps to retain the land. It was recommended other areas should also be explored. City Attorney Hopkins stated action to acquire that site could pose a potential problem if a developer is already requesting consideration for development; such consideration would be on an impartial basis. Councilman Petta felt the Planning Commission should make its own decisions and Council should not interfere; when a matter comes to Council, then Council can take appropriate action. Supported enforcing property maintenance; if the problem is minor, enforcement should be judicious. Felt it is Council's duty to provide a base to generate sufficient revenue to provide adequate services for future generations; felt Council will make proper decisions. Councilman Evans felt City ordinances should be enforced but should not be dictatorial; relative to property maintenance, the question is how and who will determine whether businesses and residences meet the requirements; regulations for property maintenance must be specific and not open to interpretation. Feels Barton Road is the key to commercial development and will open up other development; needs to be improved from Mt. Vernon west to La Cadena, including the La Loma Page 6 - 3/7/85 Hills area. Development must be controlled and compatible with the size of the City; does not advocate large-scale commercial development - feels proper development of Barton Road would provide sufficient tax base. Feels information should be provided indicating what is needed to provide the necessary services and infrastructure to serve as a guage for the amount of commercial development. Feels a mutual understanding is needed between the Planning Commission and Council relative to the direction on commercial development; feels well -planned development is needed; prepared to suggest to Council and the Commission that the City explore a master plan for the community that will create a major theme and marketing tool that can be used to enhance any potential future development. PUBLIC PARTICIPATION Bob Keeney, 12139 Mt. Vernon, questioned why Area 12 was included with Areas 10 and 11 when they involve completely different zones and circumstances; felt it unfair, since they are attempting to downzone from Commercial A-P to Medium Density Residential that would create less traffic problems. As owner of property in Area 12 zoned A-P, stated he had always been included in R-R, Residential. The City Attorney noted that area was initially included in the mass zone change and, because of the opposition, those having opposition were returned to staff for further review and comments. In order to expedite, they were returned in groups; felt the three Areas had geographic proximity and common problems - there was no intent to penalize. John Mathews, 11733 Eton Drive, concurred with much of what had been said; felt commercial development which would only serve the community would be insufficient to produce needed sales tax revenue; questioned that rationale. Councilwoman Pfennighausen felt the meeting opened up communication and both bodies should work in concert; felt a need for mutual goals, control, and flexibility. Noted that problems posed 17 years ago if Grand Terrace didn't incorporate have happened, with the surrounding land being developed by Colton instead of the City; felt a lesson should be learned. Recommended determining how many and where crossings are needed over Gage Canal and then proceed to acquire them, noting the legal means. Recommended establishing development goals and a plan so developers will know what the City wants. Felt high interest rates create need for multifamily dwellings in the future. Mayor Pro Tem Matteson recommended conducting a joint meeting at least twice annually to discuss and resolve mutual problems. Mayor Grant concurred the meeting was productive. Agreed with the need to improve the tax base; would modify to an extent his position if it meant acquiring revenue; felt the entire City should be explored for economic development. Page 7 - 3/7/85 ADJOURN - The Adjourned Joint Regular Meeting adjourned at 9:42 p.m. TEe next Regular Meeting will be held March 14, 1985, at 5:30 p.m. Respectfully submitted, APPROVED: Page 8- 3/7/85