09/08/1987GRAND TERRACE PLANNING COMMISSION_
MINUTES OF REGULAR MEETING
9EP EMER-8, 19$7 - -
The regular meeting of the Grand Terrace Planning Commission was
called to order at the Grand Terrace Civic Center, 22795 Barton
Road, Grand Terrace, California, on September 8, 1987 at 7:00 p.m.
by Chairman Norman Caouette.
PRESENT: Norman Caouette, Chairman
Fran Van Gelder, Vice -Chairwoman
Jerry Hawkinson, Commissioner
Gerald Cole, Commissioner
Stanley Hargrave, Commissioner
David Sawyer, Planning Director
Joe Kicak, City Engineer
ABSENT: -.Ray Munson, Commissioner
Pledge of Allegiance: Jerry Hawkinson
1. MINUTES
WORKSHOP CONVENED AT 6:30 P.M.
Information/Comments from Staff
Information/Comments from Commissioners
WORKSHOP ADJOURNED AT 7:00 P.M.
PLANNING COMMISSION CONVENED AT 7:00 P.M.
Applicant/Forrest
City Dillon
CUP/SP-87-1 Chairman Caouette stated that the applicant,
CUP/SP-87-1 Forrest City Dillon, had asked for a
continuance. It will subsequently be heard on
September 21, 1987.
MOTION
PC-55 Commissioner Hargrave moved that CUP/SP-87-1 be
continued to September 21, 1987. Seconded by
Commissioner Hawkinson.
MOTION CARRIED, ALL AYES. 5-0-0
1
GP-87-3
Z-87-3
Chairman Caouette stated that items #2 and #3
(after item changes that had been agreed upon in
the workshop) were related to an item that would be
discussed with the Site and Architectural Board and
would like to continue those items.
Chairman Caouette moved onto item #4, Interim
Ordinance.
The Planning Director gave the conditions of GP-87-
2 and Z-87-2, west of Interstate 215. He presented
the staff recommendations for the Interim
Ordinance.
Commissioner Hargrave asked what the overall
objective was in adopting the Interim Ordinance.
The Planning Director stated that it was to provide
clarity to prevent confusion on which density and
zoning regulations will be in effect for the
westside and the remainder of the City until the
General Plan is completed.
Commissioner Hargrave asked which zoning codes the
public would follow if the upcoming revisions
lasted 6 months.
The Planning Director stated that currently the two
ordinances that they are speaking about are not
effective yet. Due to the second reading
requirement which is scheduled for Thursday and the
30 day minimum requirement. So until then they are
dealing with the ordinances they have had in the
past. He mentioned that technically without these
ordinances they would be working with those changes
that they put into effect for the westside. In
essence, we would have two zoning ordinances one
for the eastside and the westside.
Commissioner Hargrave was opposed to the Interim
Ordinance because of the resulting two sets of
rules.
Chairman Caouette asked if this was not a clean up
measure with development moratorium.
The Planning Director stated that this is the City
Attorney's suggestion for clarification proposed.
Commissioners Hargrave and Hawkinson expressed
concern with the time lapse between the current
codes and final approval of upcoming changes.
PUBLIC HEARING CONVENED AT 7:00 P.M.
2
Chairman Caouette opened the Public Hearing for
opposition or those in favor of the item. No
discussion.
Chairman Caouette brought the item back for
discussion by the Planning Commission.
MOTION
PC-87-56 Commissioner Van Gelder moved that the proposed
Interim Ordinance be approved. Commissioner
Hawkinson seconded.
MOTION CARRIED, 4-1. COMMISSIONER HARGRAVE VOTED
NOR.
PLANNING COMMISSION ADJOURNED 7:30 P.M.
SITE AND ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW BOARD CONVENED 7:30 P.M.
The Advocate School
Mt. Vernon Avenue
Private School Facility
Chairman Caouette opened with item #5, SA-87-7,
proposed private school facility.
The Planning Director presented the proposed
conditions and staff recommendation.
Chairman Caouette asked for any questions from
staff.
The Planning Director stated that the applicant had
not shown up for this evening's meeting.
Chairman Caouette was hoping to ask the applicant
how the existing buildings would be brought up to
standards.
Vice -Chairman Van Gelder asked if a condition could
not be stipulated to have the grounds maintained
according to standards.
The Planning Director stated they could approach
that issue on a conditional use permit.
Commissioner Hargrave asked where the block wall
and landscaping would be located.
The Planning Director stated that it was agreed
upon at the last Planning Commission that the wall
would be intermittent, approximately 6 ft. in
height, along the south property line.
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Chairman Caouette opened the Public Hearing for
discussion from the public. No responses.
Chairman Caouette opened the discussion from the
Planning Commission. He asked the Planning
Director to clarify a condition for upgrading the
building standards.
MOTION
PC-57 The Planning Director stated that the condition
could be that the existing buildings match those
for the main proposed structure that are approved
by the Site and Architectural Review Board.
Chairman Caouette so moved said condition. Vice -
Chairwoman Van Gelder seconded.
Vice -Chairwoman Van Gelder asked if this would
include windows.
The Planning Director stated that they would look
at the pproject and make any changes that would be
needed to bring them into similarity with the
proposed buildings as much as possible.
MOTION CARRIED, ALL AYES. 5-0-0.
Chairman Caouette asked if they wanted to wait for
the applicant before they went on with the Site and
Architectural Review.
The Planning Director stated they could move onto
another item.
There appeared to be no further need for discussion
from the Planning Commissioners.
MOTION
PC-58 Commissioner Hargrave moved that they approve SA-
87-7. Commissioner Hawkinson seconded.
MOTION CARRIED, ALL AYES. 5-0-0.
MOTION
PC-59
SA-87-9 Chairman Caouette brought up item #6, SA-87-9
related to earlier discussed CUP, apartment complex
on Mt. Vernon Avenue. He moved that this be
continued on 9/21/87. Commissioner Hargrave
seconded.
MOTION CARRIED, ALL AYES. 5-0-0.
01 4
CDS Engineering
SA-87-8
Barton Road
Chairman Caouette opened the Site and Architectural
Review on SA-87-8.
Planning Director presented the combined staff
report for the site and architectural review
item, as well as the zoning and general plan
change.
Chairman Caouette asked for questions for
staff.
Discussion was brought up on the parking
requirements and clarification of the parking
shortage.
Planning Director stated that the hotel project
itself has a requirement of 88 units; 1 unit per
each of the 88 units for parking spaces and 1 per
employee. That would bring the total up to 100
parking spaces required for the hotel, plus a need
for 4 loading spaces which are not identified.
There are presently 84 spaces, which is a shortage
of 20 parking spaces.
Chairman Caouette opened the discussion for
comments from the applicant.
Michael Palmer
CDS Engineering
15002 Skypark Circle
Irvine, CA.
Mr. Palmer referred to the original staff report
which had approved 88 parking spaces on the
original project. He referred to a letter
submitted by the developer, Tsang, that they felt
due to the lack of vehicle usage by senior citizens
the 88 parking spaces would be sufficient. He
mentioned that they would be prepared to eliminate
a sidewalk to the front that would give them the
24' setback for turnaround in the parking, which
would allow 10 additional parking spaces.
Commissioner Van Gelder referred to condition #12
stating the usage of an elevator. She asked for
clarification of the project as a convalescent
hospital or a senior citizens hotel.
Mr. Palmer stated that it was a senior citizens
hotel.
Commissioner Hargrave asked what would be
substituted instead of a sidewalk.
Mr. Palmer stated that pedestrians would probably
walk down the easterly part of the project.
Commissioner Hargrave asked the Planning Director
for clarification of the conditions and the
original 88 parking spaces in the original
project.
The Planning Directory stated that when this
project came before the Planning Commission one of
the conditions of the CUP was that there be, one
per each employee, and one per each unit. There is
flexibility in the code but was not used.
Chairman Caouette recalled the original project.
The two problems they had with the parking on the
project at that time were the required amount of
spaces and the location of the parking lot
originally.
Commissioner Hargrave asked of Mr. Palmer if there
was any way to make parking available to the north
of the retirement home.
Mr. Palmer stated that those spaces were set
aside for the commercial center. He mentioned that
was the original design for the property and came
up with a better plan putting them to the south of
the property.
Commissioner Hargrave stated that unless they can
find specific documentation on the variance for
property requirements then he did not see any
reason to exempt the applicant from parking
requirements for the retirement hotel.
Commissioner Van Gelder asked the Planning Director
to research this issue for the Planning Commission.
The Planning Director stated that they could
research this but in preparation for the meeting he
did not find any exemptions and the CUP
requirements are still in effect. In order to have
that eliminated there would have to be a re—
hearing of the CUP to remove any condition pending
approval by the Planning Commission.
The Planning Director presented the staff report
dated August 5, 1985, which contained the
conditions for the CUP and it was the conditions
that were made a part of the motion and passed and
not the text of the staff report which was referred
to by the applicant.
C. 6
Chairman Caouette clarified that there was no
condition stating it had to have 88, and the
requirements of the code would stand.
The Planning Director answered that there was a
condition stating they had to have 88 plus 1 for
each employee.
Chairman Caouette mentioned that he remembered
discussion on the possibility to actually extend
the parking lot without putting another structure
on the property. That was a possibility and taking
out the apartments to the rear and using that area
for necessary parking.
Commissioner Hargrave referred to the CUP-85-9,
condition #7, ..."provide one parking space for
each living unit, plus one for each employee."
Chairman Caouette asked about the proposed
commercial facility with 5 units 1,000 sq. feet.
He mentioned that they seemed limited and asked
what plans they had for that area.
Mr. Palmer was unable to answer the question.
CHAIRMAN CAOUETTE OPENED THE DISCUSSION TO THE PUBLIC.
Mary Lou Williams
22227 Barton Road
G.T.
Kenge Ling
CDS Engineering
15002 Skypark
Irvine, CA.
c
Expressed opposition to the commercial development
in this area.
Mr. Ling, developer, referred to the earlier
approval of the parking conditions of 88 spaces.
He stated that the 12 employees they have, are part
time so they would not need the full time parking
spaces. He referred to the site plan that showed
50' space in the front, enough for 3-4 loading
spaces.
In reference to the commercial plaza, it could be
5/1,000 sq. ft. or 5,000 sq. ft. or further
breakdown whatever the tenant wants, not restricted
to 1,000 sq. ft.
He referred to the problem of the neighbors to the
westside of the property, they do have access. He
requested approval of the site plan by the
Commission.
Commissioner Van Gelder asked for clarification if
the front 4 loading spaces are loading/unloading
for supplies or people.
Mr. Ling clarified that they have supplies
delivered on the service area on the southside of
the building. The front 4 loading spaces are for
people.
Helen Stringfield
22273 Barton Road
G.T. Expressed opposition to the restaurant at that
location due to insufficient land space
and parking area.
CHAIRMAN CAOUETTE CLOSED THE PUBLIC HEARING.
CHAIRMAN CAOUETTE CONVENED PLANNING COMMISSION DISCUSSION.
Commissioner Van Gelder suggested that she would
rather see a landscaped area, walkways, park
benches in front of the retirement hotel.
Commissioner Hargrave stated that the dinner house
was not part of the original proposal. He stated
that the applicant approved the project before
without the dinner house. He recommended that SA-
87-8 should not be approved.
Chairman Caouette referred to a copy of the 1985
original conditions which reconfirmed problems at
that time on parking, ingress -egress sites. The
original conditions call for improvement to the
access to the project immediately behind the site.
MOTION
PC-60
Commissioner Van Gelder asked of Chairman Caouette
if he recalled what use the developer had for this
area in front on the 1st Site and Architectural
Review.
Chairman Caouette stated that it was originally
planned for parking.
Commissioner Hawkinson made a motion that the
project be denied and resubmitted with a revised
plan. Chairman Caouette seconded.
Chairman Caouette asked for clarification if that
resubmittal would be for landscaping and parking
only.
Commissioner Hawkinson answered yes.
C8
The Planning Director mentioned that the item could
be continued and the applicant be asked to bring
back revised plans. The other alternative would be
to have a resubmittal if the project is denied.
Commissioner Hawkinson stated for clarification
purposes that it be a resubmittal in regards to
landscaping and parking only not including the
commercial plaza project.
The Planning Director stated that they are hearing
Site and Architectural Review for the project with
the Commercial structure. They have to come back
with the landscaping parking detail as the project
stands already. If we take out the current
commercial structure then we are eliminating the
actual need for the current Site and Architectural
Review.
Commissioner Cole asked if under the original
agreement, if the parking and landscaping were for
staff approval.
The Planning Director stated that it was for staff
approval and referred to condition #7, 1985, and
pointed out that nothing requested them to come
back for Site and Architectural approval.
�} Commissioner Cole stated that he understood it to
mean that if it was staff approval, then the course
of action this evening would be to reconfirm or
deny.
Chairman Caouette asked if it would be approved or
denied by Planning Director or Planning Commission.
The Planning Director stated that it would be a
staff item.
This motion was withdrawn and resubmitted.
MOTION
PC-61 Commissioner Hawkinson moved that this project be
denied as submitted, SA-87-8. Chairman Caouette
requested that it be brought back as a cursory
review and seconded the motion.
Planning Director stated that it could be reviewed
during the workshop.
MOTION CARRIED ALL AYES. 5-0-0
Chairman Caouette suggested that the General Plan
9
and Zoning revisions on this project be handled at
a later date.
The Planning Director stated that the applicant
could appeal the Site and Architectural decision
but may wish to have the General Plan and Zoning
applications continued thus leaving open the
opportunity to move the parking without the
commercial structure.
Chairman Caouette stated that the General Plan and
Zoning denial would follow since the Site and
Architecture was denied. They could appeal that
also.
The Planning Director stated that when the
apartment complex to the rear is redone, changing
this area from residential to commercial
redevelopment this time may cause a problem later
if the hotel's parking is not moved. He mentioned
that continuing would keep the item open.
PUBLIC HEARING
Kenge Ling Mr. Ling agreed to a continuance of two weeks.
10i7611-ro
PC-62 Commissioner Hawkinson moved that GP-87-3 and Z-87-
3 be continued to September 21, 1987, with
conditions of landscaping and parking.
Commissioner Cole seconded the motion.
MOTION CARRIED, ALL AYES. 5-0-0
Break
RECONVENE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
Chairman Caouette brought up discussion on the
Advocate School, even though the applicant had not
shown up.
Discussion by the Planning Commissioners on
different suggestions for fencing and landscaping.
Suggestions of rod iron with intermittent
landscaping, brick wall or chain link fencing. The
high cost of block wall was brought up and loss of
visibility with this type of wall. The concensus
was not to have a solid block wall.
The Planning Director stated that the Chapparal
Pines Retirement Home was considered in staff's
10
recommendation of a block wall, to lessen the noise
level. However, staff would be willing to work
with the developer on landscaping and fencing.
Commissioner Hargrave asked about any zoning change
for the future.
The Planning Director stated that the zone change
was a possibility due to their bank's request. It
is sort of a compromise because they are willing to
go forward under R-3 zoning and later revise the
zone to AP.
MOTION
PC-63 Commissioner Hawkinson moved to approve SA-87-7.
Chairman Caouette seconded.
MOTION PASSES, ALL AYES.
PLANNING COMMISSION ADJOURNED AT 9:00 P.M.
Respectfully submitted, Approved by,
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Planning Direc r Planning Commission
11.